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Mac OS 8.5 and 8.6 Cross-Platform Issues


This page contains a list of Mac OS 8.5 and 8.6 bugs and conflicts that affect cross-platform integration. Some of these items are noted in Apple documentation, others are reports from readers. There are also some notes on positive effects of OS 8.5 on Mac-Windows integration. So far, Mac OS 8.6 doesn't appear to have fixed many of these problems. If you know of any other issues, please let us know.

On this page:

Networking

Emulators and x86 cards

Miscellaneous


Networking

Virus checkers and network volumes

Mac OS 8.5 has a compatibility problem with some virus protection software that prevents copying files to mounted network volumes, including those of Windows NT Server and AppleShare IP. Basically, this problem occurs with Norton AntiVirus 5.0.2 and earlier and Virex.

We have descriptions of several different symptoms and solutions on the Server Tips page.

AppleShare IP 6.0 incompatible with OS 8.5

Apple Tech Info Library article 24684 reports that Mac OS 8.5 is incompatible with AppleShare IP 5.0.x and 6.0, Apple's cross-platform file/print/web/email server software. That is, the sever can't run on a Mac with OS 8.5. (Clients can run OS 8.5.)

SOLUTION

Upgrade to AppleShare IP 6.1. Apple says it will post a free upgrade for ASIP 6.0 owner, though it isn't up yet. The new version also fixes a couple of bugs with Windows users, Windows clients can't save from within an application, and the display of the incorrect date and time in Windows' Properties dialog box.

Windows NT Server SFM and command-click

Several readers have reported that on Mac OS 8.5 clients, command-clicking on a title bar of an NT Server Services for Macintosh volume won't open the pop-up menu. After our reader reports we have a theory of what's happening and a solution.

Todd Parkhill reported:

"When I mount any of the shares from my Win NT servers I cannot move up to higher levels by Command-clicking on the title of the window/folder. It works fine on other AppleShare servers and even on an NT 4 Workstation running PC/MacLAN. It doesn't even acknowledge the title as being a button. Instead, it just goes into the drag window mode."

Kannan Paul had the same problem:

"I've experienced the same problem as another of your readers in that we cannot command click the title bar of a window to go up levels, it just goes into window drag mode. This only happened after installing 8.5, and is fine from other machines running 8.x to the same server."

However, Paul E. Jacoby told us that command-clicking works just fine for him under OS 8.5 using NT SFM volumes as well as with SMB volumes mounted with DAVE 2.1.

Todd Parsons suspects volume size (May 6, 1999):

We are currently experiencing this same problem, and it is one of the main reasons some of our Mac users haven't switched over to OS 8.5 yet. I work in the IS dept. for a large printing company - All of our production staff uses Macs. The above problem came about when we got a few 8.51 machines... we have tested on 8.5... same thing. The interesting thing is that this volume is 40 Gigs. We have other smaller volumes on the same server that 8.51 can handle just fine... Mac OS 8.1 can handle the 40 Gig partition as well. Our systems are all current, Macs and NT - all the latest drivers and whatnot.

So I am curious - is it a size issue perhaps? Is there something that the readers who are reporting this problem have in common?

However, Paul Kannan did not find the problem restricted to small volumes (May 7):

Using Mac OS 8.5.x to command click on mounted NT server volume windows--just as a little update. We have the same problem on 2gb volumes right the way up to 12gb volumes, I haven't however tried smaller volume sizes. This problem doesn't happen with either Dave or Cyan' s product [MacServerIP].

What's happening and how to prevent it:

We recieved this report on May 10, 1999, from a person who wishes his name withheld:

LONG DESCRIPTION

The problem appears related to the fact that NTFS volumes always have the FILE_ATTRIBUTE_HIDDEN property on the root directory of the volume. I believe this is because NTFS uses these bits on the root directory to indicate that the file system is NTFS and not FAT.

If you use the Win32 API GetFIleAttributes on the ROOT directory of an NTFS volume (for example, "e:\"), it always has the FILE_ATTRIBUTE_HIDDEN bit. However, if you use his same API against a subdirectory (say,"e:\myshare"), it will only have this bit set if someone set it. Using Explorer, you can view the properties of a subdirectory by right clicking. However, if you select a root directory and do properties, you do not see the various file system attributes -- you only get the volume information (label, file system, capacity).

In any case, this FILE_ATTRIBUTE_HIDDEN bit is translated by SFM into the AFP protocol as the folder being invisible. In the Finder, when it attempts to show the folder hierarchy, it gets confused because the root is "invisible" and consequently doesn't show the hierarchy.

SHORT DESCRIPTION

The end result is this. If you share an ENTIRE VOLUME with SFM, you will experience the problem, because SFM translates the volume's root directory "hidden" flag as "invisible" to the Finder, and the Finder behaves as such. However, if you share a SUBFOLDER of an NTFS volume with SFM, you will be OK, unless you specifically set the "Hidden" attribute on the folder in Windows.

Additionally, because the Finder sees the root directory as an invisible folder, users trying open a file on the server from within Sherlock will get an error message telling them that they can't open files that are inside of an invisible folder. We have a discussion of the Sherlock/invisible folder symptoms on our Windows NT Unsolved Mysteries page.

Windows NT Server and IIS4

Kannan Paul saw this problem with both NT Server Service Pack 3 and Service Pack 4 with clients running Mac OS 8.5:

"One slight problem, although I am yet to verify if this is actually an SP4 problem, is that if you have Mac access to an IIS4 web site, if you try and edit a file whilst the web server is serving it, every so often, keeping the file open on the Mac, and then accessing the same file via http, going back to save the file after editing again, it gives a -61 error. If you wait for about a minute you can save your changes. I have tried changing all sorts of cache settings, but cannot seem to cure this."

Sherlock problems with NetWare, Unix Netatalk

Apple TIL article 30845 reports of a problem with Mac OS 8.5 Sherlock and various versions of Novell NetWare as well as Netatalk on Unix. When users search on a mounted volume, they get an error message when clicking on an item in the Items Found list. Windows NT and AppleShare volumes do not have this problem.

Sherlock and DAVE Conflict

Greg Newton of Delta "T" System writes about a problem with searching a mounted DAVE volume with Sherlock:

"There is a known issue between Mac Clients with OS 8.5 & OS 8.51 running Sherlock when logged onto an NT server using Dave 2.x. When searching the mounted NT volume, Sherlock will find the file, however clicking on the file name in the Sherlock files "found" window yields and error message stating that the file cannot be found. Sherlock is unable to display the path with the various folders where the subject file is located. The only work around is to use the Find File application that comes with OS 8.0 & OS 8.1. Thursby software reports that this is a known bug and is working on a fix.

"Questions: When will someone work out a method for Sherlock to "index" amounted NT volume?

"Does Sherlock have the ability to "index" an NT volume on a server running Service for Macintosh?"

Sherlock problems with Microsoft Proxy, SOCKS proxies

Readers have reported that Sherlock won't search the Internet through a SOCKS proxy servers, such as Microsoft Proxy Server. However, Apple has said that the Mac OS 8.5.1 Update "provides some improved communication through Internet proxy firewalls for Sherlock." For more info, see Tech Info Library article 26165.

NetWare Client login error

Apple's Mac OS 8.5: Open Transport 2.0 Read Me - Part 2 has this note about using the Netware client on Mac OS 8.5:

"When using Netware Client version 5.11 configured for Netware IP service, the first login may yield a Netware Configuration error message. To avoid this error, open the Netware IP control panel and change the value under Domain SAP Server (DSS) Retry Attempts from 1 to 2. You can also change Open Transport TCP/IP control panel to always load TCP/IP into memory (open the TCP/IP control panel, click the Options button, and click the "Load only when needed" box to remove the X)."

OS 8.5 improves NetWare Mac client compatibility

On September 29, 1998, Jeremy Bascom reported that a beta of Mac OS 8.5 cleared up his problems with the Novell NetWare client on his G3 Macs. He said that OS 8.x "randomly will not allow IPX to "bind" to the board and causes freezing fairly regularly. However, upon beta testing Mac OS 8.5, "all problems (minus the printing issues present on all machines) have been resolved." Bascom is running the Client 5.11 with latest released update.

Mac OS 8.5 bug with FileMaker and IPX

Charles Gardner reports a problem with Mac OS 8.5 and FileMaker Pro 3.x / 4.x:

"Mac clients set to IPX/SPX network mode can no longer 'see' or access FMP Server host running on NT Server 4.0 platform. Fortunately the TCP/IP mode does work."

Vicomsoft Internet Gateway update for Mac OS 8.5

In October 1998, Vicomsoft posted an updater that provides Mac OS 8.5 compatibility for Vicomsoft Internet Gateway 4.5.2, a previous version if it's Mac-based Internet gateway for Mac and Windows clients. Vicomsoft Internet Gateway 5.0 is already Mac OS 8.5 compatible.Vicomsoft says that versions before 4.5.2 may not work with Mac OS 8.5.

NetDoubler doesn't work with OS 8.5

Several readers have reported that Asante's NetDoubler doesn't work with OS 8.5. Nate Caplin (a systems manager at Knight Ridder), offered an explanation: "Asante 10/100 Ethernet cards require AsanteFAST driver software version 3.1 for compatibility with Mac OS 8.5, but NetDoubler does not work with AsanteFAST 3.1 (on any version of Mac OS)."

Caplin also confirms reports that Asante has dropped NetDoubler support for Mac OS.

"When I asked Asante about NetDoubler (on several occasions to different support personnel), I was told that NetDoubler would not be developed further because "Apple has done a lot to address network copy speeds in its latest OS." Basically, this is true. A Mac OS 8.x client accessing an AppleShare IP server achieves lightning fast transfer speeds (especially OS 8.5 with AppleShare IP 6.1 Server), because it uses TCP/IP instead of AppleTalk. NetDoubler is just a hack to do the same trick.

"Furthermore, Asante discontinued NetDoubler NT last summer. I can't find it for sale anywhere, and Asante also confirmed this. I don't know about the Unix version. Asante support implied on several occasions that given the compatibility problems users have experienced (especially the most famous, data corruption saving Quark files over a network), and the limited sales potential due to recent and impending improvements in the Mac OS, they've decided it's not worth their while to continue development.

"The only thing NetDoubler accomplished that still cannot be accomplished with any other tool (well, maybe SpeedDoubler offers something similar) is a significant performance boost in transferring large files from Macs using peer-to-peer file sharing. Apple has only implemented AppleShare over TCP/IP between Mac OS clients and AppleShare IP servers." [And not peer-to-peer. However, MacOS 9 nows supports TCP/IP peer-to-peer (AFP/IP) file sharing.--Ed.]

LaserWriter 8.6: Halts NT SFMPRINT.exe

Many readers have reported a printing problem with Mac OS 8.5.x and 8.6, which turns out to be the LaserWriter 8.6 driver in most cases. However, there is another know problem with LaserWriter 16/600 PS printers that causes similar symptoms (see the Server Tips page)

The reports began with NT Sever MacPrint, in which NT reports a MacPrint error of a semaphore time-out. However, Marcus Reese says it also happens when using AppleShare IP 6.1 as a print spooler . Readers have had the problem with NT 4.0 Service Pack 3 and Service Pack 4. However, on February 18, Robert Robinson offered a solution, which Reese has confirmed through testing.

Ole Frandsen first reported the problem to us:

"I've encountered a remarkable problem using Mac OS 8.5.1 on our workstations up against Win NT 4 sp3 and the problem persists with Win NT 4 sp4.

"Since I've started upgrading the Macs from OS 8.1 to 8.5.1 I have the daily occurence of the SFMPRINT.exe halting when printing through the PrintManager, resulting in "printer not found" or plain systemcrashes on the Macs.

"The only way out is to reboot the Server and everything seems to be OK for yet another day. Stop and start the service only results in SFMSVC to crash and you have to reboot anyway.

"Is it just a coincidence the problem started showing on the very same day I began updating the Macs?"

Several other readers have also reported this problem.

Greg Newton doesn't see the problem with Thursby Systems DAVE on the Macs:

"As a suggestion to the 8.5.1 Mac OS problem with SFM on an NT4 Server... Don't use SFM! Update your clients to DAVE 2.1 and the printing problems will basically disappear. We have used this product since the release of DAVE 2.0 and are very happy with the performance and compatibility."

But Marcus Reese of the National Broadcasting Company writes:

"I have the same problem as Ole Frandsen. The problem of printing to a NT 4.0 server with Mac OS 8.5.1. I've reformatted and reinstalled Windows NT Server 4.0 twice and it doesn't matter what service pack you install. After a few hours of sending print jobs to the NT Server our Freehand 8 programs will crash with all the menus on the Macs turning ether green or a redish color. The more Macs I installed OS 8.5.1 on the faster the problem would appear. I''ve even upgraded our Fast Ethernet Hubs to 10/100 Switches with no luck."

On February 9, Marcus Reese further wrote:

"I've done some more testing and here are the results.

"The error the NT 4.0 SP4 server gives is a MacPrint error of a semaphore time-out. Once this happens no Mac on the network can print not even directly to the printer. Doesn't matter if you're on OS 8.5.1, 8.5. I tried using minimum extensions on with no results. Once the time-out appears the only recourse is to restart the server. Logging out and then back in, stopping and restarting the print spooler doesn't help."

And again on February 10, Rees added:

"Some how Open Tansport from OS 8.5x overloads the Mac Print Services on a NT server. I didn't have this problem with OS 8.1. Only after upgrading to OS 8.5 did this problem appear. Once OS 8.5 crashes the MacPrint services on the NT server no Macs on that network can print. Not even directly to the printers. The only way to be able to print again is to reboot the NT server. How weird is that."

March 22, 1999
Wim de Lange of Intergraph Computer Systems in the Netherlands reports the same problem, different cause:

"Concerning the Apple laserwriter driver 8.6 halting the print services for Mac: We can easily simulate the problem by simply printing more than 126 PS jobs. After job 125 or 126 the printing service stops. I tested also the Adobe PS printer driver, but the same error!! We are testing with Mac OS 8.5.1. and NT SP4. Only with Mac OS 7.5.3.the problem is over."

March 26, 1999
Wim de Lange added that LaserWriter 8.6.1 doesn't fix the problem:

"Concerning the printing problem (NT SFM printing stops after 124/125 jobs), I printed the same amount of jobs with the new Apple Laserwriter driver 8.6.1. But, stil the same error!"

March 26, 1999
Dave Gammage reports that he found the problem beyont SFMPRINT, in Color Central spoolers on NT

"I ran into similar printing errors while printing to Color Central spoolers on NT from Mac OS 8.5.1. It does the same thing as SFM spooling...it works fine for a while, but locks up after several hours. I temporarily solved the problem by making all the new machines running 8.5.1 print directly to the printer, and letting the older macs run through the CC spooler."

Readers offer solutions to MacPrint freeze problem:
(for the problem, scroll up)

February 18, 1999 -- Robert Robinson wrote to say that he has found the cause of the Mac OS 8.5.x/NT SFM print problem:

"We have several customers that have had the same problems. The problem is not with system 8.5x but with the LaserWriter 8.6 print drivers. When they down graded to LaserWriter 8.33 the problems seem to have disappeared."

On February 26, Marcus Reese added another point about LaserWriter versions:

"This problem also appears when using AppleShare IP 6.1 as a print spooler. When using the print spooler option in AppleShare IP 6.1 the incoming print jobs will slow down and bring the AppleShare IP 6.1 Print Manager down to it's knees. And eventually will not process any print files at all.

"It's the LaserWriter 8.6 extension that comes with OS 8.5. I've removed that extension and its related extensions (Desktop Printing, Printing Lib, etc.) and replaced it with version 8.5.1 from OS 8.1. LaserWriter version 8.5.1 still does have a bug in it which is that not all spooling devices will show up in the chooser's print window the first time the chooser is opened. If you refresh the LaserWriter's printer window by clicking on AppleShare and then back to LaserWriter 8 all print devices will correctly show up in the window.

"I'm using LaserWriter version 8.5.1 unstead of older version 8.3x because version 8.5.1 is PowerPc native. That's a big speed difference when printing big files or generating PDFs or Postscript files."

March 3, 1999 -- Rault Kehlor reports a problem with the LaserWriter 8.6 driver and FileMaker:

"I wanted to add that I've been having problems printing from OS 8.5.1 with the LW8 v8.6 as well. Printing from Filemaker Pro, both versions 3.04 and 4.02, has been sporadic and, for certain of our DBs, repeatedly impossible (the pages spool OK from Filemaker, and also seem to get to the last page in the Desktop Printer window, and then the error message "Cannot print to the printer XXX because of an error" pops up with the red stopsign icon.)

"Reverting back to the Laserwriter 8.5.1 drivers fixed the problem.

"We print to an HP Laserjet 5siMX, directly using AppleTalk (not via the printserver on our NT 4.0SP3 server--but it is shared there for our PC users).

"Maybe there's a connection, or maybe the problem with the 8.6 laserwriter drivers cause more problems than just with print spoolers!"

March 15, 1999 --

Sascha Ballweg wrote to say that back-stepping to LaserWriter 8.5.1 works, but you loose certain features, such as custom page sizes where the width is greater than the height. The solution--use Adobe's PSPrinter Postscript driver, which offers more features. Ballweg also thinks the Adobe driver is more compatible with certain applications than LaserWriter 8.5.1. Adobe's driver is also called 8.5.1, but does offer more features than Apple's driver.

May 15, 1999 -- Mac OS 8.6 clears up the problem

Jeremy M. Van Zee of The Dallas Morning News reports that LaserWriter 8.6.5 provided with Mac OS 8.6 does not cause the problem:

"I can confirm that the 124th print cycle initiated from a Mac using LaserWriter 8.6 will cause NT 4.0 (SP3&4) SFM Print to stop accepting print requests. The good news is that LaserWriter 8.6.5 (Installed with the Mac OS 8.6 upgrade) does not appear to halt SFM Print. I have been able to successfully print over 1000 jobs - still no error. By luck or design, Apple may have fixed the problem."

May 15, 1999 -- Mac OS 8.6 doesn't fix the problem

However, Marcus Reese of the National Broadcasing Corp. reports that Mac OS 8.6 hasn't fixed the problem for him:

LaserWriter driver 8.6.5 that comes with Mac OS 8.6 did not fix my problem of printing with Freehand 8 and LaserWriter 8.6 using Windows NT 4.0 Server as a print spooler for my Macs. This problem I have reported to you in the past. I don't get any error messages on the NT Server and I still have to restart the NT Server to stop Freehand 8 from locking up on my Macs. I'm going back to LaserWriter driver 8.5.1.

Similar Problems with LaserWriter 8.7

March 15, 2000
Marcus Reese

If it's installed on even one computer on my network of 25+ Macs, weird things start to happen. Printers will show up twice in the Chooser, printers will be delayed showing up in the Chooser and when selecting a printer, two or three will be highlighted also. All the Macs on the network will be affected. So I'm staying with LaserWriter 8.5.1. It's stable. LaserWriter 8.7 isn't.

March 29, 2000
Tim Larsen

I was having the problem with OS 8.5 and after downgrading to LW 8.5.1 everything was fine, for a while. All of a sudden it started happening again, the NT spooler was locking up. The only thing that has changed is OS 9 is on a few machines. When the first person upgraded to OS 9 I was concerned, but no problems showed up. Now more and more machines are running OS 9 and the Problem is back. Have you heard of any problems with the LaserWriter 8.7 in OS 9 or am I the first? Can I downgrade the LW driver in OS 9 to 8.5.1, or is it incompatible?

Another problem with NT SP5 and LaserWriter 8.6.5

June 3, 1999

Chris Santos reports that the problem of NT SFM hanging after 1000 prints is fixed with the Mac LaserWriter driver to 8.6.5 that comes with Mac OS 8.6, but he has a new server crashing problem related to printing. He says the problem does not occur with SP3, so he suspects SP5:

We upgraded the server to sp5 and also upgraded the Mac LaserWriter driver to 8.6.5 that comes with system 8.6 that solves the NT mac queue crash problem from NT sp3 with the SFM hanging after 1000 prints.

Now, when we print from a mac to the sp5 queue, NT accepts the job then immediately crashes with the Blue screen.

We've done several tests on separate macs both with text files and photoshop files. It appeared to ocurr when printing from photoshop 5 from both macs but we don't yet know if it is something in photoshop or it is sp5 on NT.

When we reverted back to sp3, the problem was solved. So it may be SP5.

June 11, 1999

Chris Santos updated his report:

There must be a Microsoft Bug here because the blue screen appears.
  1. Install Windows NT 4 Server, then install SP5 (40bit or 128bit)
  2. Install Services for Macintosh
  3. Create an AppleTalk printer share on the NT server (be sure Mac Printing service is started)
  4. Install LaserWriter driver 8.6.5 (latest version with new color sync features and solves other Mac printing problems) on a Macintosh.
  5. Send a PhotoShop print (or a browser print) to the NT Mac printer share

    What WILL happen? The NT queue will begin receiving the job and noting that it is spooling.Next, as soon as the job stops spooling, bang!, the blue screen 'o death appears.

    Things I know: SP4 never really installs winprint.DLL, it gets installed in SP5

    Temporary Solution

    We can use the latest version of the LaserWriter 8 with SP3 withOUT NT crashing. (Has to be a bug on the MS side and not the LaserWriter side.) We haven't tested the new LaserWriter 8 driver with SP4 (just way too many variables to test out. I'll leave it to the bug crackers).

Wim de Lange says that the problem disappears when he does the full upgrade to Mac OS 8.6, but doesn't when he just uses the LaserWriter driver 8.6.5 that comes with OS 8.6:

I tested after upgrading to MacOS 8.6 (upgrade is about 34MB!) and the print problem was over!! You can delete jobs etc. and Windows NT is still printing from Mac.

September 7, 1999 -- Bryce Steiner brings up a good point about NT Service Packs in general:

There is one problem with how Chris went about this. In NT you should always reinstall the service pack AFTER installing a service or new software. Otherwise the newly installed SP files get overwritten by the older buggier files.

LaserWriter 8.6.5 conflict with Quark, and Postscript RIP for NT.

November 30, 1999
Bryce Steiner reports of a conflict with the Mac LaserWriter 8.6.5 driver:

In QuarkXpress or Freehand 8 (or anything else that uses the LaserWriter printer driver dialog box) You can tell the PostScript screens to angle, but when printed to a Harlequin RIP they all come in at 45 degrees this is with the programs separating the colors NOT the RIP. All overrides are turned off on the RIP. This does not happen with the LaserWriter 8.3.4 I know works fine.

Network file transfer slows down

This is not a server problem, but an Ethernet driver issue.

There is a known problem with OS 8.5 that causes network transfer rates transfer rates to dramatically drop after upgrading when Farallon or Asante Ethernet cards are present. It has been report that trasfer rates can drop down to 100 kbytes per second. The problem is caused by the OS 8.5 installer, which copies file called "Apple Enet" into the extensions folder when you have one of these cards. The problem is, Apple Enet is the driver for an Apple Ethernet card, and doesn't work well with these other cards.

Solution:

Turn off the Apple Enet extension in the Extensions Manager to fix the problem.

March 17, 1999
Jeff Lucia

Just read your report on client transfer slow downs being related to the Mac OS 8.5 installer.....and I cannot quite agree. I have a client who has 13 G3's (No Asante or Farallon NIC's) connected to a 10baseT switch, NT server hooked in via 100BaseT Switch full duplex....and OS 8.51's transfer performance is plain dismal. We're talking 25 MB in about 3.5 - 5 minutes. I have no choice but to temporarily move the 15 Gigs of data to a G3 running ASIP 6.1.1

What's worse, is that the are very long pauses by the server itself (All workstations and server are ABSOLUTELY virus clean) especially after opening Illustrator documents. Clicking on text, the arrows appear in the upper left corner for about 30 seconds....then you can move the text. It's also random, so the same machine might work perfectly the following day. It can also occur if only one machine (out of the 13) is on....taking out the speculation of a overburdened network or server.

I've tried all of the suggestions your site (from killing the Mac Volumes to changing priority levels)...and have not seen any improvement. Anyway, if any of your readers have further suggestions or maybe have seen a similar problem, I'd love to hear them.

ASIP 6.11 seems to be handling the load fine....so I'm hoping (aside from using a NT 5 Beta) to resolve this issue with the current NT Server. It was working fine up until about two months ago. I am going to do a complete rebuild (format.....stuff like that)...to see if I can get this to work.

PS. Here are the Server specs:

Dell 4200, 400Mhz, 256MB RAM, 42 Gig RAID 5, with Dual Port 20 MB RAID

controller (RISC). NT 4.0 Service Pack 4

Emulators and x86 cards

PC Compatibility Card Networking

The Installing Mac OS 8.5 document on the CD has this note:

"Computers with DOS Compatibility Cards
Apple DOS Compatibility cards do not work with Mac OS 8.5. After you install the software, you will no longer be able to use your DOS Compatibility Card to run DOS or Windows software."

It turns out that this isn't quite true: You can run DOS and Windows in the DOS Compatibility Card and PC Compatibility Card, but networking doesn't work. Apple told us that it hasn't tested Mac OS 8.5 with the cards and doesn't plan to.

SOLUTION

Jason Linhart of Summary.net has written a patch that enables Apple PC Compatibility cards networking to work under Mac OS 8.5. We've posted the readme file from this patch at the MacWindows Emulators/Coprocessor Tips page. The readme file promises partial networking, but reader Paul Jacoby says it gave him full networking with his Apple Pentium 166 card in a G3/233 desktop:

"I just did the upgrade to OS 8.5 this afternoon, ran Jason's patcher on the PC Network Extension, rebooted, and everything works just fine on the PC Card! Networking is fully functional (using DHCP via my NetGear RT328 router). I did not have to make any other changes (swapping some extensions was referenced on MacinTouch in another note from Jason on November 6th)."

DOS Compatibility Card and virtual memory

Henry Donzis has found that the NuBus Apple DOS Compatibility Card requires virtual memory turned on with Mac OS 8.5. However, the PCI PC Compatibility Card does works on OS 8.5 with virtual memory turned off.

"In order to run the DOS compatibility card (the 6100 486 Houdini card) with OS 8.5, virtual memory must be turned on. The DOS card will not startup if virtual memory is turned off. The PCI PC compatibility card works just fine on OS 8.5 with virtual memory turned off.

"Of course, you still want to apply Jason Linhart's networking patch. You might want to add Jason's second message about needing to use different networking extensions instead of the new OS 8.5 network extension."

Old SoftWindows and Networking

A reader reports that the older SoftWindows 4.0 version can't network when running Mac OS 8.5. This is similar to problems with the PC Compatibility cards (mentioned above) and older versions of Virtual PC (below). The current version of SoftWindows, 5.0.4, works fine on OS 8.5. Windows networking also works with SoftWindows 4.0 and Mac OS 8.1.

Orange Micro cards and programming

Kevin Killion is having problems with file corruption when using CodeWarrior for Mac to do extensive editing on a number of files when the OrangePC C: drive file is mounted on the Mac desktop. The problem is worse in Mac OS 8.5. CodeWarrior suddenly reports problems with a file, which then shows data corruption. Killion says he has been able to do this with Finder-mounted Virtual PC C: drive files. Killion says Orange Micro recommends editing from within Windows.

Virtual PC 2.0 and 2.0.1 Incompatibility

Apple Technical Info Library article 30790 says that Mac OS 8.5 is not compatible with Connectix Virtual PC versions 2.0 and 2.0.1. VPC users need to upgrade to version 2.1 to run it under OS 8.5.

Miscellaneous

Office 98 and FileMaker 4.02

Gregory Newton reports of a problem with Mac OS 8.5, Office 98, and FileMaker 4.2. At first Newton thought the problem happen with Mac OS 8.5 client accessing a FileMaker database on an NT server, but he discovered it also occurs on Macs not connected to a server. The problem occurs with Excel 98 running and Word 98 running.

"When copying an object in Excel (specifically a chart) and switching to Word to insert the object into a document, selecting the EDIT menu freezes the machine. The box around the menu name changes color indicating that a menu selection has been made, but before the menu can pop down, the freeze occurs. Hitting command+option+escape to force a quit, a dialog box pops up asking if you want to quit FileMaker not Word 98. Forcing a quit, FileMaker apparently quits, leaving Word 98 and Excel 98 running normally so you can complete the insertion of the Excel object.

"Attempting to relaunch FileMaker results in a warning dialog stating that the maximum number of FM licenses for this machine has been exceeded and it will not start back up. The only way to get FileMaker back up is to reboot the client Mac. It appears that FileMaker is "watching" the copy/paste activity causing the freeze up and conflicting with Word/Excel actions. This does not appear in machines running OS 8.1."

Removing the Excel v4.02 FileMaker Extension from the FileMaker Extensions folder has no effect...Deleting version FileMaker 4.02 and doing a clean reinstall of version 4.01, I reran the test with Word 98 & Excel 98 and lo and behold, the freeze problem disappears. After repeated testing with 4.01 with no problem, I installed the 4.02 update, and BANG the problem is back."

Adobe Acrobat Exchange Incompatibility

TIL article 24674 says that OS 8.5 is incompatible with Adobe Acrobat Exchange. Adobe says it will fix the problem in it's next release.

File Exchange requires Internet Config 2.0.2

Apple Tech Info Library article 58168 says that the File Exchange control panel (formerly known as the PC Exchange control panel) requires version 2.0.2 of the Internet Config extension. If another installer automatically installs and older version of the extension, the File Exchange and Internet Config control panels won't open.

Support for Euro currency symbol

Mac OS 8.5 has complete support for the European Union's new Euro currency symbol, which goes into affect on January 1st, 1999. Mac OS 8.5 has 18 system fonts that support it (option-shift-2). Previous versions of Mac OS use the international currency symbol for this key combination. An Apple Euro web page discusses these issues as well as printing with various drivers.

Microsoft has a Euro Product Update for Windows 95. Windows 98 supports the Euro and has 4 fonts that are "Euro enabled," ( AltGr-5), according to a Microsoft Euro web page. Windows NT 4.0 Service Pack 4 adds support for the Euro symbol along with 5 Euro-enabled fonts. There is also an NT 4.0 Euro Product Update. Windows 2000 (formerly NT 5.0) will support the Euro symbol when it ships next year.

The cross-platform issues with the Euro symbol should be the same as with any font -- you need to have the same font on both platforms for the best results. Adobe has three free Postscript Type fonts for Mac and Windows that describe the euro currency symbol. There's more information at the European Commission web site and at a downloadable PDF file.

Saving a file to a folder with more than 500 items

Mac OS 8.1 to Mac OS 8.6 appear to have a problem when you try to save a file to a folder with more than 500 items. You get an error message: "There are too many items in this folder." At first, this seemed to be a problem with NT Server volumes, but readers have reported it on local Mac volumes. Apple told one reader that this is a Mac OS problem. Other readers suggest that it occurs with application with old code, particulary the older-style Open and Save dialog boxes.

B. Gary described the problem this way:

We are running NT4 SP 4 on a cross platform environment (Win 98 and OS8.1-8.6) and we are experiencing this problem:

When attempting to save a document from within an application (simple text,Word, etc.) to a volume that has more than 500 items we receive the following message in the save window:

"There are too many items in this folder. Some will not be shown."

When we reduce the number of items, it works fine. Also, the items that it chooses not to display seem to be arbitrary.

September 21, 1999
Bryce Steiner

I have this on all my Macs also, but it's not on a volume that has more than 500 items, it is a folder with 500 items. The Finder seems to be able to see it though, apps like PageMaker and Quark can't. I'm running WIN2000 with AFP/IP, but I had the same thing under NT4 also running AppleTalk. It appears to me as if it were a Mac Issue but I don't know for certain.

September 22, 1999
Bryce Steiner

It happened under 8.1 and now it happens on 8.6. I have one folder with 1300 files which are all PC files but the Finder can see them all without any error messages, but programs such as PageMaker 6.5 and Freehand 8 and others give the error message. I think that there is just some old code in these programs that are not taking advantage of the OS's new way it sees files.

September 21, 1999
Ryan Kennedy

I work for a k-12 district in New Jersey and at our High School our Macs attach to our NT 4 file servers. Since we have over 1000 users on that server the list of user folders gets quite long. So long in fact, that the standard Mac open and save dialogs (even the new ones in OS 8.1 and up) cannot display all of them (at one point I knew how many items could be displayed, but the number has escaped me). Our solution was to create another share in SFM that had aliases for all of the user directories, spilt up in several sub folders (A-D, E-G etc). It's not pretty... but it works. Too bad NT doesn't have the feature that NetWare used to have... and that ASIP 6.2 has... hiding folders that users don't have access to (home directory).

We were told by Apple K-12 edu that this is a Mac OS problem, not an NT problem.

September 22, 1999
Tim Nowak  

I have run it to this error on the NT/Mac network at work BUT this is not an NT volume issue. I have seen this exact message on my Mac at home which is not on any network at all. I seems to happen with applications that still use the old open/save boxes. I don't think I usually see the message until there is over 1500 or so items in the folder.

Thomas Vanderlinden
September 24, 1999

Vanderlinden reports that Apple told him that is indeed a Mac OS problem:

This message appears in Open and Save dialog boxes using the "standard file" software (that's been part of the OS since 1984) when there are more than 680 files in a folder. "Navigation Services" which is available as an option under 8.1 and is preinstalled on 8.5, does not have this limitation. Unfortunately, most applications are not yet taking advantage of Navigation Services.

 


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